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Advice needed about Liver and Kidney's


Hi All...

I'm not 100% sure if I put this in the right section. But here goes. Basically I was a 100% raw foodist for 9 years. No cooked foods. No grains. All organic, green juices daily, no sweeteners, just very very cleansing type lifestyle. I researched the pit falls of rawfoods and steered clear and modified and made sure I was getting the mineral dense greens on a consistent basis, as many raw food recipes call for large amounts of nuts and seeds, and sweet fruits, which for some can cause problems.

So the beginning stages of becoming raw after fasting for 1 month on the master cleanse and transitioning over to raw foods, my skin exploded, which isn't new, I had attributed it to " detox " cleaning out the years of unhealthy habitual eating. Usually the breakouts would always be centered around the chin and philitrum area, right above the lip lines, which would turn into whiteheads, and is acne, not other things like cold sores etc. But sometimes also in scalp and back. Red inflamed. So when I first went raw, my skin exploded. But as time went on, and doing many different cleanses, and alternative health treatments, as well as researching how acne can be connected to digestion, and liver, or possible parasites, for those 9 years I cannot count the amount of liver cleansing herbs, flushes, colonics, colon cleansings, parasite cleansings zapper, as well as meditional spiritual tai chi's that became part of my lifestyle as well as just the general cleansing of a raw food lifestyle with emphasis on green leafy juices and highly mineral rich spirulina,chlorella powder and other superfoods.

So about 4 years into a rawfoodism the acne and other issues had improved greatly, but the red marks from the previous acne would never fade, and I would still periodically break out around the mouth area... in spite of eating so clean, in spite of going number 2 a healthy amount, So I decided to try acupuncture for the first time.

I go and at the time was told I have Spleen Qi Deficiency and Kidney Yang deficiency. She told me at the time that I needed to stop eating raw foods, and eat more warming foods. Of course at this time I wasn't ready to hear that, or give up eating raw foods. So I researched and connected with a raw food coach familiar with acupuncture, and gather some more info. Basically decided to cut out all the seet sugary fruits I and sweeteners I was consuming, and up the sea weeds, greens and mineral richs foods. Which I did, and my acne diminshed. I would occasionally get a few now and then, yes in the same area, around the mouth or chin, but it was very infrequent, however the red marks from the places the acne came before, still never left.

I go for 1 month of treatments once a week, and also make the chinese herbs into a tea as was given to me. But I felt no diff a month into it. Cost wise I couldnt afford it anymore. But this was all while I was a raw foodist.

5 years I ate raw food with no sugary sweet fruits, lots of healthy fats, greens, and I felt good. But as the 9 year approached something switched. I was feeling so lethargic, I was losing muscle tone badly, despite eating expensive raw vegan protein powders daily, and working out, energy was gone, and during the raw food eating of course raw food being more YIN I had to sleep with a jacket on and long pjs, if I ever had my legs in shorts at night, I would start to get a headache on the right or left side of my head, which i believe is connected to the gallbladder meridian.

But when summer would come I would be fine. Well this past summer it was 80's in Los Angeles in June, and I was freezing. I would make my daily green juice and get a headache right after, which never happened. Something was off and I could feel it. So I started researching, I was exhausted all the time, but broke through my program that raw food was the healthiest way to eat, I reached a saturation point and it was time to move on. So I got lots of blood work done,etc and found some alarming things, my adrenal glands were waisted, I was suffering from dehydration despite daily large glasses of juice and consuming huge amounts of water through out the day, very low b12 inspite of supplements, found out that Im extremely glucose sensitive that my body cannot use it for energy, Im missing certain enzymes, my blood sugar was high, insulin was high, even though I was consuming no sugary foods. My copper levels were way too high. Zinc way too low. I was getting headaches daily... which was something that never happened.

So after working with a nutritionist, etc decided to transition back into eating healthy grass fed meats, etc. I'm not new to nutrition so I took the proper steps into incorporating cooked foods again in a gradual way. I got this. But as soon as I did, my digestion stopped. From going 3 times daily, to maybe 3 to 4 times a week. Yet I didn't feel constipated. But yet again, started to break out again all around my mouth. Cue the eye roll! Here we go again. Facial flushing, Feeling too hot. Sweating. Before it was the opposite, now I'm on the other end of the fulcrum.

Yet I was feeling better other than that. I felt warm again, I had more energy, I felt calmer, my headaches stopped. So now I'm at the 6 or 7 month mark, and the acne comes and goes, but when it comes it comes strong. Then a few weeks back the headaches started again, bad, daily. The breakouts. Also my hair started to shed more and more than ever before as I added meat back into my diet.

Sorry to go on and on, but here is the crux of my long winded post. I go to acupuncture again, a new place. I'm expecting issues with my stomach meridian, spleen, digestive issues etc. I tell them in the beginning of the session all these issues I have had, the daily painful temporal headaches, the results from my blood work etc....

So I find out that what is going on is :

Liver Fire
Liver Wind,Liver Yang Rising

Kidney yin deficiency
Kidney qi deficiency

The I go for the treatment, and when I had acupuncture before, certain spots were more tender, especially on the foot. But when they put the needle in the LIV 2 especially on the right foot, it was as if my foot had a mind of its own (body mind) lol and it jumped away as soon as that needle went in, and the whole area became red, but I'm a trooper and after a moment of deep breathing, it eased up, but it was the most pain I ever felt getting an acupuncture treatment. It proceeded in other spots on the foot, just immense pain and pressure. Which eased up, I can take it, but it was an eye opening experience as never had so many areas be so painful.

After the first treatment, I go home and get a headache that night. So I purchase the herbs they recommendeda Gastrodia Complex with Gastrodia Notopteryglum Tuber fleece-flower Angelica, Chuanxiong, Magnoliavine, Privet, Kudzuvine. It helps a bit. But still dont feel that great. So I go for a second session, and again the treatment is very very painful.... The next morning I wake up and have a throbbing pressure headache in the middle of my forehead, which I never get. It doesnt go away till 12 am that night. Advil didnt help, which usually if its temporal and its unbearable, hesitantly I will take something, though I dont like to. But nothing helped. I read how head aches in the middle of the forehead can be related to large intestines and stomach. Shrugs.

After the last session I decided to take a break on the acupuncture. I started researching the issues I was told, and maybe make some modifications for my eating.

So literally I have clusters breaking out around my mouth, my head is killing me, in between all this I decided to order some liquid chlorophyll as I had not been juicing anymore, and most of the greens I consumed werent raw, but steamed etc.

Literally the next day after taking the chlorophyll in water my acne is 60% improved, my digestion speeds up, no headaches. So I'm literally confused about all this. When I was a raw foodist I had kidney yang deficiency, spleen qi, low energy, coldness... Now eating a healthy cooked diet, Im having acne, Im hot and sweaty at times, my digestion is sluggish.... Yet with 1 measly tsp of Chlorophyll things changed drastically.

Now my acne is improved 70 % but still daily instead of 10 marks there is 3 or 4, so its improved. So my confusion is how does one with the specific issues Im having seek a balance? Hmm If I eat raw foods, my acne will go, my digestion will improve, but I will run into the same issues I know, yet when I eat the opposite I run into the issues discussed.

The acupuncture place I went to was quite hard to understand as they were from Asia. But after researching about foods for liver and kidney issues that I listed, Im just a bit perplexed on how to handle this... Which is my main question, what food choices should one make with these issues? Any chinese herbals for the liver and kidney issues that will help beyond what I originally took?

Sorry to go on and on and on, as I'm just trying to gather any more knowledge and steps to take, because all these signs and things happening are showing me my body is out of balance and I'm trying to at least get it back on track as best I can. Thanks so much


Could you post a picture of your tongue? That would be helpful. I highly doubt that you have LV fire and/or LV Yang rising and the headaches were likely brought on by too strong of a treatment - particularly too strong of a descending function in someone with a history of weakness. A pic of your tongue would tell me much more.

With regards to diet, I always guide people away from raw food diets and unless they are doing it specifically for animal rights reasons against vegetarianism/veganism as well. The reasons are common sense, some are guided by TCM theory, and then for the most part they are driven by the clinical realities of having seen and personally experienced myself too many of these weakness related conditions after the 5-7 year mark.

The best is a broad diet that is 95% vegetarian - but a broad range of foods in season with minimal fruits and no raw, no salads, smoothies and the like (perhaps some raw, some salad in hot seasons/hot climates).

I generally recommend eating only red meat (chicken, pork, etc. are considered neutral energy in tcm (so I consider them useless so to speak) and most fish is considered yin as are vegetables so there is little point in fish unless you like it). I recommend eating meat only when you feel weak and/or more in the winter (perhaps weekly in colder climates) and less in the summer (perhaps none, energy level depending). For women I usually recommend some meat following menstruation and more following child birth. That seems to work best.

From a humanitarian perspective if everyone cut their meat consumption by 70% we wouldn&#39t have many of the issues plaquing that industry in my opinion. In a broader perspective then there is less reason to be a martyr for a cause and more reason to be an educator for less consumption. Not saying you are being a martyr choosing that diet - it&#39s a wise thing to experiment with to help you find a proper middle ground, but many people suffer through feeling so poorly just because it "has" to be healthier for them.


Are amateurs allowed to make comments here, or is this site only for professionals? This isn&#39t clear to me.

If it was me who had those problems, I&#39d go for mineral & vitamin supplementation, especially Vitamin A (from fish oil), lots of it. Also Vitamin E. I have a list titled "Traditional Chinese Medicine&#39s Functions of Vitamins" and under vitamin A it says: "tonifies blood, benefits the Jing essence, brightens eyes, nourishes skin, clears heat from blood & treats deficiency fire patterns."

Believe it or not, I swear by an old book by Adelle Davis (1965) and together with my slight understanding of Chinese medicine find this approach helpful.

Since the questioner is now eating meat, I&#39ll bet a daily dose of liver might do the trick. Sure doesn&#39t hurt to try.


Anyone can post on our site and offer suggestions. I will say, however, that the information should be partial to Chinese Medicine - which is what people are generally asking about. As for vitamins and supplement suggestions - it is crucial to note that there is no definitive way of understanding these in TCM terms and doing so is a very debatable idea. From my perspective Chinese Medicine has little congruence with modern vitamin and supplement supplementation. On a personal and clinical side I am strongly opposed to the vast majority of supplementation. Most large scale clinical studies have shown either no or negative health effects from basic supplementation - like a daily vitamin. And very few others have shown any positive result whatsoever except in specific cases and in most of those only when the person had proper tests to verify that they were low in "x, y, or z".

When compared to Chinese Herbal Medicine in particular there are far too many unknowns with using these substances and most roads point to negative longer term health benefits or at the very least expensive urine. Now oils and the like are somewhat different and need to be discussed separately. Personally and professionally, I keep two things in mind which run somewhat counter to our western mentality - first more is -not- always better and second is a more common sense thing that it is better to get our nutrition from food not from substances that cannot possibly account for the truly dynamic nature of food itself.


Hi Davy,

My suggestion to you is to unlearn everything that you learnt about your body. Stop measuring the levels of elements in your blood. Your body believes you and it just obeys what exactly you believe in and it doesn&#39t matter whether it is right or wrong. I will give you an example. In the dark if you catch a rope and if you believe that it is a snake then your heart rate increases, sugar level increases (go and measure what all happens to your blood elements at that moment). But even if you catch a snake in the dark and you believe that it is a rope nothing happens to you.

Check out my comment on the post vegan diet

Just follow these principles and don&#39t worry about anything else. Your body knows how to heal you. Our body has a knowledge and it works on its own. We have our own knowledge and that is nothing to do with our body&#39s knowledge. Just believe in your body, talk to your body, listen to your body, tell to your body to heal all the pains and problems and then forget about it. Whatever your body is doing, it is doing it for a reason and that is for your own good and well being only.

Your responsibility is only to follow these 5 principles as I mentioned in the above link which will ensure your digestive system is producing all good quality elements to your blood stream and your body takes care of everything else. Stop worrying you are absolutely fine.


I know you&#39re talking to Davy and not to me, but I wanted to put in my 2 cents&#39 worth!

This is directed to all medical practitioners:

the treatment/cure has to suit the patient. Some people due to their mental constitution need a more hard-knowledge-based approach.

Other folks find that a directly mental, psychological, "talk to your body" approach is what speaks to them.

Others are open to anything.

Some patients/clients want the doctor to just "do" things to them, and others are hardwired to be unable to "just take orders" - they need to be fully involved and need to do things and make some decisions for themselves, using the doctor just as an advisor. That, too, can be considered a psychological approach.

This may not be considered a valid point of view, but for the few times I&#39ve been to medical practitioners, I size them up more than they&#39re sizing me up. If they look quite unhealthy, and have a poor personality, please tell me why I would take advice from a person who supposedly has the capacity to cure others but does not care about her own health. For me, the vibes are all wrong. For another patient, this does not matter at all. May God bless them all.

I think Davy needs some high-test, easily digestible food supplements. Including digestive enzymes. He says, "My digestion is sluggish." I do not believe that TCM is against this. In this modern day & age, TCM can be viewed as a framework within which to judge diets, supplements, etc. rather than only Herbs, Acupuncture, Qi Gong. I&#39ve been to a few doctors of TCM with family members as well as for myself and every one of them had a Blood Pressure device and used it. That is hardly an "ancient Chinese practice". Why, they didn&#39t even have the concept of blood pressure.

Thank you for reading tihis.


Hi Wyandotte,

I agree with you, please note that I am not saying anything against your advice. Look at the long history he has explained. All these many years he has been to many treatments and tests and procedures. Why do you think he was not cured and he is still having problems and trying to treat? Does that mean all the practitioners who have given him treatment were wrong? Or all the test and diet patters given to him were wrong? No, it is not like that. The patient&#39s mind and body has to receive the treatment. It doesn’t matter how good the treatment or the practitioner is, if the patient is not receiving the treatment then it will not work. In my experience I have seen many patients who were more concerned about their health and trying to keep track of everything. If they see any test and see that there is little difference with the normal value then they feel worried. This worry depletes the Earth Qi in the Sp and St which will still make the things worse. I first try to remove this worry from their mind and I have seen good results from all of them. Almost everyone will say that they don’t feel worry but still they want to do all the test and procedures. But I am telling you, at least for a moment they will fell it if they look at the report. By looking at his long history, I think he should first unlearn all he has learnt about his body and stop analyzing and worrying. Then he will be ready to receive the treatments. After that if he follows your advice he will be cured once for all. This is only my opinion based on my experience. Whatever the way we follow all our wish is to get him good health.

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